– Hey, this is David Villa in
Tampa, Florida. I’m the CEO of IPD and hey Gary,
I got a question for you. How do you deal with the sacred
cow with a top performer in your business that generates
a ton of business but is toxic to your
company culture? – Fired! Fired. Fired, David. Fired, David! Does he have anything else? – [India] Eliot and I thought
you were gonna say that. Tox, fired.
– Yep. – Even before he
finished, right? Good guess. Fired. Fired. Fired.
– Yeah. – Fired. – It’s fired.
– It’s fired. – Life is short,– – It’s not even about like
living your best life and life is short.
It’s you lose. Like, you lose. Like you’re just gonna cap out. It’s like math-based marketing. Eventually, you run out of time. And you can only
extract so much. – You know what? It’s like, you
know you have someone like JR Smith on your team and he’s
eventually going to implode and cost you a championship. (crosstalk) – No, no, JR Smith, JR Smith
as the number one on that team. – Yeah. – When the top performer
is toxic, you are finished. – It’s game over, yeah. – The other thing, by the way is you have to be the most, you have to be
the top performer. To me, that is the number one
thing that I’ve always loved about my businesses
which is, I don’t know, I just don’t rely
on anybody. I could never imagine running a
business that I would sit there and say if DRock quit. – He’s scared of that
guy quitting because he’s the top salesperson.
– 100%. – That’s what, I can
see the fear in his eyes. – 100%. – If he wasn’t he’d be like
well, I’ll just do the sales. – He wouldn’t even
ask that question. By the way, in a
car salesman world, there’s a billion
great car salesmen. By the way, in the comments
section if you’re a tremendous car salesman and up for
moving, leave a comment. – Absolutely. – Alright, Jase, you get to
ask the question of the day.

do you think it’s a bad idea to
give your boss a heads up before receiving job offers so they
can prepare for your departure? – I think that’s every single person. You know,
that’s a tough question. A very smart question. To me, I wouldn’t tell them. I just think it’s a
survival of the fittest kind of thing. Like if you think
it’s a vulnerability that you’re not
gonna be able to find. Like I just don’t, that to me that’s
the risk thing. I just wouldn’t do that, because if they reacted poorly, even after five years,
thank you very much. Thank you, that’s very nice. Thanks Tyler, it made it! You know, I, I wouldn’t do that because that
could get you to zero, and I, you know, don’t forget, they fire you on the spot, then you start taking a job that you don’t necessarily
want just to pay. And now you’re
in a two year cycle of having crappy jobs. Like it could turn
into a whirlwind. Now, if your moral compass
is going off inside, like crazy and
you can’t sleep at night, then do you. Like, I just think everybody’s different. To me, doing the right thing is always the right thing and if for you
that’s the right thing, then that’s fine. But make sure that’s
the right thing for you, not the way your
mom sees the world, or your friends or anybody else. That has to be your decision. And if you’re okay
with the consequences, I’m okay with
the consequences of speaking the way I speak. Meaning, I leave lots of money on the table for cursing. I’m okay with that. You have to be okay
with the consequences. I hate people that are ideological, and then when they have
to face the consequences, they regret. You know, it’s the right thing. What’s the name? – [India] Erik. – Erik, it’s the right thing to do sounds good on paper. If it’s truly the right
thing to do for you, then great, then do it. But, if it’s not,
and then you get fired, and then you don’t
have another job, and who what? You showed a couple of people, “you’re a good guy?” Like, I think a lot
of people front. – [India] Interesting.
– Yeah. – [India] That’s actually not
what I expected. – You expect me to say,
yeah say it? – [India] Yeah. – It’s easy for
me to say, though. Right? By the way,
I wouldn’t do it, India. And people don’t do
it here all the time. Like, I know two
people right now that are actively on
the way of going out. And I don’t, I’m not
mad at them, I get it. Like, you know… I’m not
paying their mortgage. I’m not feeding their family. You know business is,
businesses fire. Like, you know, right? So, I don’t know, I get it. But I’m giving
the real answer here. I think that everybody’s different. But I definitely would
not tell my boss. I would work on it, get the job, and then I would go. That’s why I’m not a hypocrite. I never get mad when
people do that here. I understand, you know.
– [India] Yeah. – It’s scary. You know how
many people are living in this crazy, big, city, that we can now see. It’s expensive,
and they’re on their own, and they’re parents
couldn’t help them, and you know,
like, that’s scary. And then what
I really get sad is, people have done that here, people have quit,
without having a job, not for that reason, but for different reasons. And then they go
into a crappy job, ’cause they’re just scared, they’ve held off
for a couple months, but now they get really scared, and they take anything. And then they’re like, two years step back, you know? Alright…

“with employees that slack
off, but are super talented? “Keep or fire?” – Mmmm. I deal with them the same way I deal with any kind of employee. Super hard worker, but maybe
slightly under-talented. In between on both fronts. Every situation in life,
let alone employees, only can be solved when
you believe there’s issues, and you have the luxury
and the responsibility. And let me say that one more time, when you have the luxury
and the responsibility of being the judge and the jury. The pressure and the onus is on you. I truly, truly, truly believe
that if there’s an employee at Vayner Media, and
there are some, plenty, no, not plenty, that’s not fair, there are some that are highly talented and are under-performing,
that it’s my fault. We haven’t created the infrastructure for allowing them to shine. Their bosses are not clicking with them, and so that’s not motivating them. We haven’t asked the right questions of the kind of interests they have. We serendipitously, you
know, the serendipity of what accounts they’ve been on. Tim how many different
accounts have you been on in your career? – Oh gosh, at least twelve. – And of those twelve, I would assume that some are more exciting than others? – Oh yeah, definitely. – Yeah, and that’s just real, right? There’s so much serendipity,
different bosses that you get, people move around, team
mates, things of that nature. And so, you know, I think
the way I deal with it is communication. You know, I have a full slate today, it’s the last kind of in-the-office day, I have a lot of meetings
I’m trying to get in. 10, five, 10, 10, five,
10 minute meetings. And a lot of the conversation
will be around that. And so I think it’s communication. You know, it’s like, hey, Rick, you know I think you’ve got
talent oozing out of your eyes, you’re clearly not
delivering on the hustle, which is an important variable here. What am I doing wrong? What is Vayner doing wrong? Instead of saying, Rick,
you’re lazy, you suck. You have to put the onus on you. When you’re a leader, when you’re a CEO, when you’re the organization, it’s on you. You’re creating the rules of the game. If you don’t like how
it’s played, change it.

“of HR and employees getting along. “How do I implement that when
everyone talks about everyone?” – Well, I don’t know if
employees getting along or HR is predicated on everybody
talking about each other? – [India] No, it’s like
how do I implement that in a place where everybody’s
talking about each other. – Oh, talking about
each other, like gossip? – [India] Yeah. If you wanna read it, but that’s how I interpreted it. – Where everyone talks
about everyone. Oh, jeez. I mean, that means it’s
broken from the top. People are gonna gossip. I’m
sure in the 600 employee– 550 employees of Vaynermedia, I’m sure people talk about each other. But it’s a net-net score.
Don’t be crippled by– Make sure you’re judging
the gossiping appropriately. Maybe it’s not as bad as you
think in the collective– Ryan, be careful. This
is an active shoot, Ryan. Yeah, clearly you didn’t realize. I’m just kidding! Do you wanna come on and apologize to the
show? Get over here, Ry. Let’s get you seven Twitter followers. – @guildgonewild, I’m
sorry for ruining the show. – Say, “Dear Vayner Nation.” – Dear Vayner Nation,
I sincerely apologize for ruining the show. And I’m
pretty sure Gary hates me now. – I don’t, I love you. – Oh. Well, thank you. – Tell them what football team you like. – The New York Jets. – That’s my boy. Get outta here! Alright. Hey, Brunchback. – Hey, what’s up? – Alright, get outta here. We need to come to 15 more often, there’s some good action going on here. Creating a culture where
people are gossiping negatively about each
other is devastating. There’s a lot more to fix.
The leadership needs to be looked at. Maybe you’re the leader. You need to really look at yourself. I think the only way to fix
a real burning building, if it’s really rampant and
negative, is to call an all hands-on meeting and go straight kumbaya, it’s all communication, it’s
put it out on the table. It’s address it head on and move forward. So, one, make sure you’re
judging it properly. Because in the scheme of
things, humans are humans. You can’t– It’s not like– I mean, Vayner’s great
culture, but at a micro level, there’s a million little
bad things going on. It’s just that you have to
look at is as a collective. You can’t turn people into
robots and not make them have all the emotions humans have, but way more importantly,
to me, if it is rampant, the only way to fix a
complete storm of this, is to bring everybody together, the leader needs to put– Starting with them,
I’ve clearly screwed up. Let’s talk about this. Probably
make some firing decisions. Because there’s probably
some cancer cells in there. It’s a real aggressive,
you need to address it. Truth is, so many of you
do not want to address it, or don’t know how, or
don’t have the stomach to, that’s the bigger issue. I
went for the dramatic moment there, you know what? Kick
in a little soft music here, for that part. This is
the important thing. Are you willing to address it? Do you have the appetite to deal with that kind of confrontation at the global scale? That’s the friction point. The
leaders don’t wanna step up and actually be leaders.

Gary, I wanna say thank you so much. My name is Vlad. I run a restaurant in Astoria, Queens called New York Dog House.
– [Gary] Okay. It’s a trademark spot so
there’s ways of growing. I’ve been doing that
for three years. Funny that, every time I reach a hurdle I wake up and you answer it somehow. So, I really appreciate
that you’re doing that so, every day you’ve
kind of helped me grow helped our business grow and what I’m having problem
right now is that we’re growing and each part of the restaurant the kitchen, the floor,
the bartending crew they become our gang, they
all love the projects so much so every time I brought
somebody new to the group, they start hazing them (mumbling) – This is gonna be a funny fucking show. There is no India in this. go ahead, keep going. So, you’ve gotta hazing
restaurant, keep going. – [Vlad] It’s starting to sound like,
“Yo guys, this is Alfredo He is joining our crew,
teach him what you know and let’s grow, yes I wanna grow.” So, instead of helping me you know, grow they start fucking shit up for him. – Yep
– [Vlad] He’s like “Yo, Vlad. What’s going on? They don’t
like me what the fuck is going? What am I doing wrong?” – [Gary] Yeah. – And you know the crew that
I have now they’re really good but I’m really good on vibes.
I’m really big on personality. – Let me, let me jump in on right here because Vlad, we need
more than one question answered on the show. – [Vlad] I told you it was
going to be long. – You know, and I think,
I referenced this either in a keynote or recently or maybe in one of the shows where I talked about one of the things that really when I
started VaynerMedia. I was obsessed with this issue,
because it was something that was a huge problem
at Wine Library. At Wine library we also grew very quickly. Grew from like 10 to 150 people and the biggest problem I had, was I don’t know if they haze them. They weren’t hazing them, they were just making
their judgment immediately. Llike literally every employee for like two years within two days. Everybody in the company was like Oh, Ricky McGee sucks crap right like like and by the way, this was
the company at Wine Library that had no training, no on-boarding. Like literally showed up
and you are like go, right. And then you had, right, so? – [Vlad] Very easy going, but professional courtesy, respect
but you bring your own style to it. – Vlad, the way I fixed
that at Wine Library was I sat down, everybody individually when I got to place, where was
not palpable to me anymore. One by one, and I told
them right to their face. That they, they were part of the solution of fixing my issue. They weren’t to go be there. And that was probably the first time, I gave any of them negative feedback, because we were growing,
everything was great, they’re making more money
and everything was great. And I told them, right to their face and then, Vlad, and
this is the tricky one, then I fired a couple of them. – Right in the mouth. I feel, I kinda have to do, even though I love what you did do. I think you just said it,
they are not part of solution. Vlad fire someone. (laughter) That’s it Vlad,
Vlad no more mic. I have got to answer some
questions. I love you, no more. Vlad you’re out, next. Let’s clap it up for Vlad. Just fire someone Vlad, Jesus. All right, let’s keep it going.

“10 percent still a good idea? “Even on a team of all-stars,
someone has to be last.” – Why don’t you set this
up, because obviously, what was the name of that person? – [India] Chris. – Chris knows about your thesis, I mean, this is a very legendary
POV in corporate America, entrepreneur land, like this
is one of the iconic things you put into the business world. Really quick, faster than
normal, tell everybody what that is so everybody knows, and then answer the current version. Actually, why don’t
you come out with that, and give it a little
life, and then tell me what the 2015 version of it. – If you believe that the best team wins and that business is a game, you’ve gotta field the best players. So in order to field the best players, you look at, any one point in time, who are your top 20,
who are your middle 70, and who are your bottom 10? And you wanna take that top 20 and you wanna make ’em feel six foot four and made for power. – What if they’re six five to begin with? – Go to six eight. (they laugh) And what you wanna do though, desperately, is make them know they’re that good. You want ’em to be excited,
you want ’em turned on, you want ’em passionate. The middle 70, you want ’em
striving to be in that top 20, and the bottom 10, you tell
’em what’s wrong with ’em, what they’re not doing
right, you give ’em a chance, if they don’t make it, you let ’em go. But when you let ’em go, you
love ’em as much on the way out as you loved ’em on the way in. – I’m a big believer in that part. – And that’s a big, important thing. – I agree. Do you feel, now you played at a GE, how many employees under
your wing on average? – 400,000. – Okay, 400,000 employees
that you were in charge of during that run as CEO of GE. Do you think that thesis holds true to VaynerMedia, 500 people? – More important. The fewer you have. – I’m gonna go a little quicker. How about, there’s a lot
of five people teams here. Five to seven people watching, listening– – And it makes it harder for some, because you’re looking straight at the five people who got you started. And it’s so tough. I was talking to somebody last night at a conference who said he had to let go his former junior partner,
and it was killing him. But he had to do it,
she wasn’t delivering. And I said, “Look, as long
as you take care of her “and you’re fair, and
you’ve explained to her “for the last year what
she wasn’t doing right, “you gotta do it.” – Do you think– – The thing that gets me
about this question is, the thing we hear again and again, we hear in this question
is, even if everybody, even if it’s an all-star team. – No such thing. – And there’s no such thing. You’ve gotta look at your team and say, “Who is the weakest player, can I upgrade, “can I upgrade?” – It’s never existed. – It’s very, very, I mean,
you can’t fall in love with your team and say, “Now
I have the perfect team.” But the next manager comes in and says, “What was that person thinking?” – Yeah, I mean– – I have another take on this, too. Why do we always focus on the bottom 10 in this 20-70-10? Why aren’t we saying,
“How exciting the top 20!” – 100 percent. – Why aren’t we talking about the winners? – Because it’s rubbernecking. It’s the same reason
that we sit in traffic all the time, Jack. Alright, let’s move on. – [Voiceover] Jeremy
asks, “As businesses grow, “what is the best solution for
documenting policy, procedure

– [Voiceover] Rafael asks, “They say you should
hire slow and fire quick. How many chances do you give your staff?” – I feel it’s funny. On this show, multiple times, I talk about not being crippled by hiring somebody because if they’re not good I’ll fire. The truth is, I have struggled for 15 plus year of my career, at least, 22, 37, I would say for the
first 15 years of my career I was not doing a good enough job in the firing department, and it still is something I struggle with. It’s just not fun. There’s nothing worse
than firing somebody. There’s nothing good about it. I usually spend an extra 20 to 30 days just figuring out the justification, of like, “Oh but they were…” I’m literally making
up stuff to make myself feel better about it. So the truth is, the
real answer for me is, we’re slow to it, even… It’s one of the things I’m trying to get this company better at is, don’t worry, any
VeynerMedia people watching. Yeah, I mean, look. I’ve definitely come to
learn that you’re doing the right thing for them as well ’cause you’re just
dragging out the process, and they’re not growing, and nothing good is gonna come of that, but…. The answer, practically,
is I use my intuition. I really do. You just have to make a gut call sometimes on can you give this
person one more chance? We are not in the one, two,
or even three strike policy here at Vayner. We have enormous continuity, and some of it has to do with
the way we fire, in my opinion. I think people see us
trying to handle things with empathy and grace, and
one thing I’m very proud of is when people are let go here, people aren’t that surprised, right? And so, people paying attention… But you don’t wanna hold on too long because then you lose the
trust of all the great people, and so I don’t think there’s a set answer. You gotta go on your intuition. I think the more interesting answer is do you think you have the
EQ and the people skills and the intuition to do
it, and if you don’t, who do you think has it? And empower them to do it. That’s the more interesting part. And by the way, that could go left field. I would tell you that if
I didn’t have that skill in my early days of Wine Library, I would have courted my mother to come in and be that person because I knew she could do it, so even think outside
of your employee base. It might be a friend who
is not happy in their job, but you know they have
the best people skills you’ve ever seen, and
maybe you bring them in for a pseudo-HR doing other things, and you want them to handle that. The firing process is immensely important in every organization,
one that I don’t think people put enough emphasis on, and there’s a lot of angles. It’s not just firing fast. It’s not just not firing. It’s how you fire. We’ve been letting some people go, at least recently, throughout
the last three or four months, and I usually am not
that close to it anymore because I’m very much
trying to scale this, but I make sure that I reach
out a week or two later, when I find out, to that
person and thank them, if they were here for a day. All those things matter.

– [Voiceover] Christopher
asks, “What are your thoughts “on employing friends?” – Christoper, this is a great question for a lot of people who watch my stuff. They make that connection on
the family business thing. I get enormous amounts
of, excuse me, email from people that are
the sons and daughters of business owners because
they knew my narrative now that I’m running Vayner with AJ, I’m getting some more
brother and sister stuff, and I’m getting a little older. I’m even getting some of the perspective from the dads and the moms. I have employed friends at both Wine Library and VaynerMedia. VaynerMedia was started with
five of AJ’s dear friends that I think the number
one advice I’d say is you should absolutely. I’m emphatic about this, and you guys know I’m big on, you know,
do what works for you, but I’m a huge fan of hiring friends, especially early on, to establish culture, to have those teammates in the trenches, especially if you’re willing
to practice meritocracy. So the key to friends is that,
here we are five years later, and AJ’s five to six high
school and college friends that started the company with us are in different places
within the organization and not really treated any
differently at the highest levels than anybody else, and very honestly, I hope they’re not listening
or watching the show, they may even be treated
slightly harder and worse than everybody else because
I’m so sensitive to it in the other direction. I expect the six of you not
to hit me up for a raise. I think that I’m a big fan of it. I recommend it. It is risky. I have fired my friends in the past. Brandon was my best friend growing up. He runs Wine Library. Risky. You know, it really comes
down to, here’s my belief. My belief is very simple. If you loose a friendship
from somebody working for you and not working out and
you having to fire them or them leaving, then your friendship wasn’t as strong as you thought. That’s the bottom line.

“Can anyone create good micro-content? “How can you make sure
your team consistently “creates good content?” – Joe, great question. First, for everybody who’s
watching and/or listening, I want to talk about the
term “micro-content.” It’s something I started
using three, four years ago. Hasn’t really caught on. I myself don’t know how often I’m gonna use it going forward. But the notion was
content made specifically for the platform. You know, the videos and the pictures, the quotes, the written words
that worked on Facebook, Twitter, Tumblr, Pinterest,
Instagram, Snapchat, Vine. It was the context of the book
“Jab, Jab, Jab, Right Hook.” DRock, throw it up there. Throw it up there, show it. They got it? – [DRock] Mmhmm. – [Gary] You got it, ok.
– [DRock] Mmhmm. – [Gary] So, you know, how do you
make good micro-content? How do you consistently
get your team to do it? First of all, content
is subjective, right? Steve likes “Game of Thrones” shows. I don’t, not that I don’t like it, I just haven’t even seen it yet. Some people watch “Game of
Thrones” and don’t like it. Very few, I think,
’cause it’s very popular. But you know, it is
still clearly subjective, that’s number one. Number two, how do you get a
team to be good at anything when you’re scaling your
kind of P.O.V. on the world and marketing to a 400
person, and downstairs, lot of comments about
downstairs, we’ll get there, um, organization. It’s about education,
but I would actually say that for me scaling and
getting my team to get there has a lot to do more with osmosis, right? Like putting it into their water stream, versus having a class that teaches it. Sure you can write a book. Sure we have lunch-and-learns
and learn-ups within the new organization, but they’re not attended that well. Need to talk about that, by the way. Um, what’s happening more here is that people are doing
and people are smart. You know, it starts with hiring
good people, smart people. And then when you realize
that you’ve hired somebody who’s not capable of learning
through that process, well then you gotta make some decisions. But to me, making good content takes a couple core pillars. Number one, you’ve got
to respect your audience. Meaning, you’ve gotta
respect the psychology of what they’re doing when
they’re on the platform. I know a 40-year-old woman
is in a different mindset when she’s on Facebook versus
when she’s on Pinterest. And that is how I try
to story-tell to her, because I know on Pinterest,
she intent to shop, aspiration to shop, and on Facebook, she’s keeping up with her
world or consuming information. And I strategize around
that, the psychology and the platform itself. Number two, when I say respect, I put out content that
I think she will like versus what I’d like to accomplish. Yes, I’d like to, give me a bottle of wine. Yes, I’d like to, a little faster, Alex, I know it’s early. Yes, I’d like to sell this,
but if I put it in a way that is more interesting to her, five under $10 bottles
of wine that, you know, help you get through the day when you have eight-year-old kids, and then you’re targeting
eight-year-old-kid moms, you’re going to start getting into a game that gives you a better chance. You know, 12 wines somebody
who’s 38 will like, and then you target people
from that were born in 1975. These are all strategies that will work. Again, very heavy Facebook. Or Instagram, taking a glamour
shot of it, in an angle, and it’s just like cool and nice. It’s like it’s all the kind of stuff. Respecting the audience,
respecting the platform, taking your agenda and making it third. – [Voiceover] James asks, “What are your thoughts on
podcasters and YouTubers

of a client because they are
just an all around clown?” – Galen, this is a funny question. I think a lot of VaynerMedia
employees are going to have a fun time with this quesiton if they are watching or listening. I think that for me I
hold on for dear life. First of all business is business. I think one of the reasons
people recommend getting rid of clients is they don’t have
the stomach for adversity. I actually can deal with the negativity and it’s business is business. If they fire me then I
deserved to be fired. But the notion of there
are clients to be fired. It’s right and a lot of
times it helps your business and so it’s about self-awareness. So for me, Galen, it’s
very late in the process, like almost borderline, I don’t know, when they take a knife and
stab it through your eye. It might not be a good
relationship anymore but that’s literally the level
that I’m looking forward to because I can handle it and
it’s not slowing me down. We’ve got plenty of clients that I think by all modern standards
should have been fired but I have not and it has
not hindered the growth because yes there’s some time
and attention put into that and even in a world where
we get lots of new business. There is value in retention.
There’s also moods. How about relationships?
Do you just get divorced when a time comes tough? The ebb and flow. Do you
just get rid of a best friend because of a bad night? Do you get rid of friend
after six straight bad nights? One could argue yes but I’d
say hmm there’s a lot there that you may want to fight for it. So I think it comes
down to self-awareness. A lot of people are not capable of dealing with the conflict
or it brings them down. To me, I like to rise to that challenge. I like that game but it comes down to my own self-awareness of me as a leader and more importantly i have
to factor in the empathy of 400 other people and
is it bringing them down. So cool, I can stomach it but
as they’re getting yelled at on the phone every single day, is it bringing them to a
place where they want to leave and so for me it’s when
it’s effecting other people that are in my family that I value more and family I mean my company that I value more than the client itself. That’s when I’m looking at
it but then a lot of times, I’m trying to surround,
interchange and account people of the people that have more of my stomach and can handle it.
To me, that is the timing. Thanks for watching episode
32 of the #AskGaryVee Show.